Riverwood Presbyterian Church

Absolutely correct. Someone commented recently about the post-modern tendency to compartmentalize everything in life - something that would have been unthinkable 200 years ago. Of course, because no one teaches or is required to learn logic anymore, making arguments pointing out these fallacies is difficult.

BTW, in fairness, the socialization of education has historically come at the state and local level, not federal. That’s changing a bit with the No Child Left Behind Act, but still….

We have abdicated and surrendered our rights and duties in some very serious areas. Our children are OUR responsibilities. End of statement.

Without trying to further politicize this post… There is an effort by some to make public education a civil right of children. This sounds good initially. But the devil is in the details. We will need to watch this carefully. If approved, depending on how the language is written, this could criminalize home & private schoolers. It could also, depending on the outcome, stretch into higher education becoming subsidized or gratis. Granted these are endgame outcomes and I don’t think that it will come to that, but incrementalism in this regard is very possible and very frightening. Keep a wary eye about these things.

While I agree with pretty much everything you’ve said, I do disagree with your opening arugment. You write, “The System requests that you relinquish your God-given mandateto educate or supervise the education of your child.” I would argue that as society, we have allowed the System to do so. It’s our fault. We have given up control and the state has assumed it. If we had not given it up in the first place then there would have been nothing for the state to take.

Patrick, I think you are correct in your historical elaboration, but my statement still stands. The System, as we now know it, requests this. My argument did not cover the genesis of this philosophy, only its status quo.

I do agree with the comments at a high level. But isn’t saying “the System’s socialization of education = bad” akin to saying “Welfare = bad” or “Big government = bad”? A sweeping statement that many would agree with, but there is so much more to it than that. As someone who sends their children to the “System” for education, I do see why more parents are turning to home schooling, especially when I see what some of the excellent home schooling moms at Riverwood are doing. But I also see valiant efforts on the part of many a teacher (the cogs in the wheel, so to speak) to work with me. I also have examples where there are not great teachers in the system.

I don’t know; maybe this is just “anecdotal evidence,” or maybe I’m misunderstanding what you’re trying to say, Tim. I just think if we are trying to make comments about the generic nature of the System, we should also keep in mind that there are bright spots in the blanket of darkness.

PR-H, Oddly enough I agree with you. A few disclaimers first: 1) I am a product of an excellent public school education. According to Newsweek, I graduated from the 15th best public high school in America. (21st in 2006) I had access to more resources than I could actually use. 2) I am not really a champion for home-schooling: I actually believe a plurality in perspective and “professors” are essential to a critical mind. 3) I view local public education as separate from what I called the “System.” The System is (as you observed) a very wide swath of beaurocracy, philosophy, and federal mandate. 4)I am in full and unequivocal support of any parent that actively supervises their child’s public school education. Public education is not the enemy. 5) I am not secretly advocating that R’wood Classical School is the only, most spiritual way to educate a child. That would be foolish and erroneous. 6) I am an advocate of the classical method for education, however. I would gladly send my child to a public school that employed this method.

With that out of the way, my main concern was only based on my illustration of the lady’s cell phone call. If we do, indeed, educate our children via the public school, the public school must be given the proper tools and authority to really do it properly. They cannot be handicapped at the threshhold of discipline. That was my main point.

My other concern (although unstated) is for the disenfranchised, poor, ignorant, and trampled. Again, according to Newsweek (2006), B’ham has the number one public high school in America. (Jefferson County, Irondale) However, that is a tiny bright spot in a dismal state for public education. Mississippi and Alabama compete yearly for the 50th slot on that list. Question: why are public schools more effective in richer socio-economic areas? Why should Northridge high school be that different from Aliceville high school only 45 minutes away? (If they are a part of the same System?) And yet, Northridge is a decent school comparatively) People with existing educations and resources make sure that their children are educated properly. Your daughters would do well at any school— simply because you have the resources, intelligence, education, and resolve to supervise the training of their mind. Your choice should be applauded, and your private efforts to work with their teachers is necessary and laudable. However, the majority of students within the public schools have been left there by their parents. Parents who have blindly assumed that the state will do their very best. And there seems to be a great malaise to do anything substantial, because those who know— look out for their own, and those who don’t are subjected to the most cost-efficient education. (Which, ironically, is not cheap nor efficient to taxpayers)

My statements were pretty wide, because there is a wider cross-section of people who are short-changed, than those who have used the System (and their own resources) to their own advantage. This may sound “liberal,” but my heart does bleed for those that don’t have the opportunity to know better.

Also, I agree that there are bright spots, and those bright spots are essential to the existing System. Kudos and blessings to every teacher that is responsible, hardworking, creative, caring, and committed to the growth of a) themselves, and b) their students. I do believe, however, (anecdotally and from reading) that the System does not encourage or reward this proper behavior in a substantial way. There are little incentives to achieve beyond the minimum requirements. Bright enthusiastic teachers get worn down, leave, assimilate, or grow bitter. I think the best things we can do as parents of kids attending public school, is to affirm and show real appreciation for a job well done.

Thanks, P, and I am behind you and your great kids!

Great exchange here. Disclosing my bias right up front in favor of classical Christian education, I’d add this. There’s nothing in the current “system” to force or incentivize parents to be involved in their kids’ education (beyond nagging about how it’s every parent’s duty, etc.).

I think that the least that the public schools could do is to require that every parent select the school that his/her child attends. When I was growing up and going through the Florence City Schools, this was the way that system worked. You could choose any school in the system.

Frankly, I don’t see any reason that this should be limited to schools in any one system. For example, if I live in the city limits of Tuscaloosa, but want my kid to go to Vestavia over in Northport, and I’m willing to take him/her there, why can’t I? If all parents had to make this choice, just like they make the choice of where to buy their groceries, it would encourage them to evaluate their options and make a choice.

Currently, though, only those parents who realize the value (and, I’d even say, moral necessity) of that involvment do it.

The “system” is merely doing what any socialized system does: slowly dying down to the lowest common denominator. No one is in a school by their affirmative choice (other than where they’re able to buy a house), so there’s no agreed upon set of values and priorities to govern a school. Even if every kid in a public school is a Christian, religion must be expunged from the curriculum, because that’s the law.

I hate to be a pessimist, but I don’t see the “system” doing anything other than going down without substantial reform.